[SPOILER] Plot Discussion Thread *Spoiler Alert*

[Ghieri]

Why don't we have a super-sceprical version?

>Lily dies at childbirth and even after 8 years or so Mandus still grieves at her death.

>Goes to Mexico in search for a treasure, because he's broke.

>Finds nothing but a tropical fever. Comes back to London, his fevered mind gives him a vision of a machine, which would make him rich.

>Constantly works on the factory, becomes more and more indifferent and/or violent towards the children.

>His children descend into the machine and get killed (for example in the steam pipes).

>Mandus blames everyone in the world and visualizes it as if he's been feeding them to the machine.

>Destroys the machine, gets amnesia.

>Travels deep into his subconsciousness, understands that he is the one to blame, accepts the truth and kills himself.


Don't really think this is true, but as a theory it will do.

Explains how his notes are all over the damned place. XD

This is probably the best explanation, it explains nearly every surreal aspect of the game, and still gives a satisfactory story.

Now, an addendum: The pig-men are also fake, representations of how mandus sees children.(Which is why they play with toy blocks, are socially amusing, horseplay in london, thus destroying it.)

The ties to brennenburg are simply to extract vitae and market it as a product. Since the pigmen aren't real in this addendum, vitae must have other market purposes, he also might have been using it to resurrect his dead children. After that fails, he destroys the machine and the game starts.

[Alardem]

I don't think the notes you find physically exist - this is particularly conspicuous when you see the lady get snatched by Pigs. The note in front of her door only appears once she slams it shut.

[rotten]

Alardem
Well, basically yes, that's the whole purpose of this theory. I'm not really into it, I just thought somebody should put it in place. Yet it too has its weak points, for example the notes by Mandus' victims and this whole Compound X stuff.

[sailornaruto39]

Maybe I didn't pay attention to the notes well enough.

What I got from the story was Mandus' wife died during childbirth. Grief stricken he renounced his faith an build a machine that he worshiped.

But I'm a bit confused about certain things
-When did he kill his kids?
-How did he forget that he was the saboteur and built the machine?
-What did he do in mexico and when did it happen in regards to the whole story
-Who was that fucker on the phone?

I'm seeing some really interpretations that are nicely piecing the story together, but I'm just wondering which specific notes(or any other instances of storytelling) are you all getting this from?

[aquilantiqua]

Why don't we have a super-sceprical version?

>Lily dies at childbirth and even after 8 years or so Mandus still grieves at her death.

>Goes to Mexico in search for a treasure, because he's broke.

>Finds nothing but a tropical fever. Comes back to London, his fevered mind gives him a vision of a machine, which would make him rich.

>Constantly works on the factory, becomes more and more indifferent and/or violent towards the children.

>His children descend into the machine and get killed (for example in the steam pipes).

>Mandus blames everyone in the world and visualizes it as if he's been feeding them to the machine.

>Destroys the machine, gets amnesia.

>Travels deep into his subconsciousness, understands that he is the one to blame, accepts the truth and kills himself.


Don't really think this is true, but as a theory it will do.

I guess this interpretation discounts any supernatural element?

OK, I'm down with the idea that AMFP could be all a journey within Mandus' mind, but I don't think it's plausible to discount supernatural involvement here. No matter how mad Mandus is, how could he have possibly accurately prophesied all of the wars of the 20th century, down to specifics like the Battle of the Somme? And I'm almost certain he was having some sort of...episode in that note where he's masturbating in front of a mirror that seems to have some pretty direct references to 20th century Germany (sulfur mustards, which was first used in full-scale battle by the Germans in WWI; Empire, perhaps referring to the German Empire; Ubermensch, a term that the Nazi party latched onto).

Someone from TCR kindly gave us some cut dialogue earlier in this thread. "Shall I tell you the difference between a madman and a prophet, little Mandus? History. Everything else is as dull and busy as bluebottles on the lips of starveling."

This could mean a whole range of things. Why was Abraham a prophet for obeying God's order to murder his own son, but Mandus is a madman for obeying the voice telling him to kill his sons? Why is Noah a prophet for following commands to build a way to survive the sky opening up, but the Aztecs' rituals for "stopping the sky from falling down" are just "mythological"? It's all down to historical interpretation and cultural bias. From an outside perspective, Mandus is a goddamn nutter, but we have first-hand perspective, and from this angle it looks like he was definitely a conduit for...something.

[Kotch]

Quick question

Is his first name ever mentioned in the game? I know it's suppose to be Oswald, but I honestly do not remember ever hearing or seeing the name Oswald in the game.

[Tiger]

The ending is so beautiful

[Gilligan's Hell]

The game story wise is in my opinion better than The Dark Descent. when i played ATDD the story really didn't make sense.

[Integria]

I just realized something. Isn't it downright impossible for someone to have managed the initial sabotage while they descended downwards?

Intriguing. The gates are far too heavy for a man to lift and are
instead hoisted aloft by a chain coiled about a tube that appears to be
spun by motors connected to these electrical switches. Whilst the fuse
is blown, the motor cannot be spun, and the gates will remain an
impenetrable barrier to progress.


Indeed, I remember that part. You fix each fusebox in turn, and each opens up the path onwards. If one were to break each in sequence, it'd have to be while backtracking through the complex. Consequently I'd make the assumption that the saboteur had to be coming from below.

---

Quick question

Is his first name ever mentioned in the game? I know it's suppose to be Oswald, but I honestly do not remember ever hearing or seeing the name Oswald in the game.

Where once we sat to weep Lily's passing, under weapons that cannot slay the angels to retrieve her from heaven. Look beyond the paintings, Oswald, where once you watched her bathe. The children must have discovered those secret places and taken refuge there.

Also, the voice actor is credit for Oswald Mandus in the credits.

[cronuss]

I just realized something. Isn't it downright impossible for someone to have managed the initial sabotage while they descended downwards?

Intriguing. The gates are far too heavy for a man to lift and are
instead hoisted aloft by a chain coiled about a tube that appears to be
spun by motors connected to these electrical switches. Whilst the fuse
is blown, the motor cannot be spun, and the gates will remain an
impenetrable barrier to progress.


Indeed, I remember that part. You fix each fusebox in turn, and each opens up the path onwards. If one were to break each in sequence, it'd have to be while backtracking through the complex. Consequently I'd make the assumption that the saboteur had to be coming from below.

Hm, perhaps he was already hooked up to the machine, and broke free, sabotaging it along the way.

I never thought the chair he sat in at the end actually made sense as a heart-removal device. The end of the arms had what looked like pronged connectors that you would see in electrical equipment. Also, wasn't his heart already assumed to have been removed and held in the South Tower, connected to, you guessed it, similar looking arms with pronged connectors on the end?

Perhaps the machine needs him hooked up in that chair in order to run, or maybe he can only truly destroy the machine by re-interfacing with it.

Regardless, I am now at least certain (in my opinion) that the chair with the arms at the end was not some funky heart-removal device, but was in face an interface to the machine itself.