[SPOILER] Plot Discussion Thread *Spoiler Alert*

[Change]

My favourite part was seeing all the Pig-men in their cells. It was quite a sad scene (and funny when one slips over trying to run at you). After that the game was less intense for me... I was the real monster haha.

Sad indeed but powerful. They were so pathetic and damaged and it's damning to see what out protagonist did to them.

That whole level hits you hard and puts in clarity the damage of your creation and madness.

I almost cried when I saw the large pigman knock over the man-dog-pig and then he limped away, It was a very depressing area, the music didn't help either.

[Kein]

During the final part of the game The Machine is recounting all of the horrors that await Oswald's kids in the coming century, including something about seeing "two brothers fall". Is this a reference to 9/11?

No, that was Oswald's own sons (twins), dying in the war ,war of Pigs. He wanted to save them, he loved them so much that he was ready to price of the world.

What is more terrifying is that you could have played the entire game as a pig yourself and not known it.

Which would explain a lot. The caged bed we woke up in. Your own heart that beats in the Machine.

Funny thing about the 'Man in the Coffin' - at first glance, I thought it was Lily. Wasn't the Machine also originally meant to resurrect Mandus' loved ones?

Nope, Machine had quite different purpose.

#4: The Pig Masks! who was putting them everywhere? what was their purpose?

It was like the trail. Hansel and Greta, breadcrumbs ,etc.

[Alardem]

The 'fever' is probably the Stone Egg's supernatural influence on Mandus.

[pikmintaro]

#4: The Pig Masks! who was putting them everywhere? what was their purpose?

It was like the trail. Hansel and Greta, breadcrumbs ,etc.

Yeah but who was leaving them around? what I mean is sometimes I would leave a room, and then come back, and there would be one there suddenly! the best example I can think of is when you go into the room where you have to lift up the Rifle, and when you go into the area behind there you look through the window, and one of those masks is suddenly on the table when it wasn't there while you were in the room!
Another example (If I remember correctly it may have been something else.), when you have to put some wheels on a machine there is no Pig mask, but when you come back to it, there is one next to it!

So that's why I'm wondering who was leaving them around, or was it just Mandus being crazy, and most of them didn't actually exist?

[Gilligan's Hell]

My Hypothesis on the Story:
1: Oswald Went to mexico to find Lost Temples (The Pig Masks might belong to one of the Temples)
2: Oswald found something in one of the Temples, it changed him drastically
3: His Wife, Lillibeth. Became Pregnant and Oswald became Ill.
4: Lily Dies during childbirth, She lived long enough to see Edwin but not Enoch.
5: Oswald, Stricken with grief, depression and anger. Designs a Machine, a New God for this revolutionary Era.
6: First Stages of The Machine completed underneath the Mandus Productions Compound.
7: Professor A comes to Check on Oswald's well being after his prolonged absence from the club.
8: Second Stages of the Machine Completed.
9: Oswald gives Professor A a tour of The Machine, Once they reach the Tripery, Oswald Traps Professor A stating "We are The Pig, We are all The Pig."
10: Professor A is integrated into The Machine. Bringing it to life.
11: They plan to Cleanse London, kidnap them an make them pure (MANPIGS)
12: Oswald finally relises The Machine's Plan and shuts it down.
13: Oswald finally falls asleep... for several months.
14: The Game Begins.

Hope this is accurate.

[Alardem]

My Hypothesis on the Story:
1: Oswald Went to mexico to find Lost Temples
2: Oswald Caught something in one of the Temples
3: His Wife, Lillibeth. Became Pregnant and Oswald became Ill.
4: Lily Dies during childbirth, She lived long enough to see Edwin but not Enoch.
5: Oswald, Striken with grief, depression and anger. Designs a Machine, a New God for this reveloutionary Era.
6: First Stages of The Machine completed underneath the Mandus Productions Compound.
7: Professor A comes to Check on Oswald's well being after his prolonged absence from the club.
8: Second Stages of the Machine Completed.
9: Oswald gives Professor A a tour of The Machine, Once they reach the Tripery, Oswald Traps Professor A stating "We are The Pig, We are all The Pig."
10: Professor A is integrated into The Machine. Bringing it to life.
11: They plan to Cleanse London, kidnap them an make them pure (MANPIGS)
12: Oswald finally relises The Machine's Plan and shuts it down.
13: Oswald finally falls asleep... for several months.
14: The Game Begins.

Hope this is accurate.

Lily died some years ago giving birth to the twins. Mandus visited Mexico in February 1899 and, upon discovering the Orb, was driven mad and slaughtered his children. Returning home with their bodies, he immediately set upon transforming his servants and creating his 'great machine' - acquiring orphans to man his factory, mental patients to transform, and capturing the rich to turn into food. Apparently this is where his 'soul split'.

Concerned by the disappearances of many an aristocrat, a professor was dispatched to investigate Mandus' behavior. He failed. What I'm confused by is what exactly compelled Mandus' change of heart and loss of memory by December 31st.

[PathOS]

My favourite part was seeing all the Pig-men in their cells. It was quite a sad scene (and funny when one slips over trying to run at you). After that the game was less intense for me... I was the real monster haha.

That was definitely the big punch in the gut for me when I played, like the pig playing with the toy blocks and especially the pig in the cage who tries to charge you then slips (or gets yanked by a chain I don't recall) and instead of continuing to roar at you like you might expect, he just sulks back to the corner and looks sad.

And yeah, "Dieses Herz" playing from the loudspeakers didn't help.

My critique would be that this area should have been saved for near the very end of the game, since humanizing the monsters such as this can remove their scariness. Alexander's monstrosities were death dealers plain and simple in the original and that added to their terror.

[Alardem]

My favourite part was seeing all the Pig-men in their cells. It was quite a sad scene (and funny when one slips over trying to run at you). After that the game was less intense for me... I was the real monster haha.

That was definitely the big punch in the gut for me when I played, especially the pig in the cage who tries to charge you then slips (or gets yanked by a chain I don't recall) and instead of continuing to roar at you like you might expect, he just sulks back to the corner and looks sad.

And yeah, "Dieses Herz" playing from the loudspeakers didn't help.

My critique would be that this area should have been saved for near the very end of the game, since humanizing the monsters such as this can remove their scariness. Alexander's monstrosities were death dealers plain and simple in the original.

I'm not so sure - the flashbacks in the original game's wine cellar helped to establish the fact that the Gatherers were men who'd been betrayed and deformed horrifically. A couple of times, they seem to recoil when having light shone upon them.

I suppose the difference between them and the Pig-Men is that the Gatherers were amoral bastards anyway, while the Pig-Men are implied to be mental patients and poor people i.e. the victims of society.

[PathOS]

I'm not so sure - the flashbacks in the original game's wine cellar helped to establish the fact that the Gatherers were men who'd been betrayed and deformed horrifically. A couple of times, they seem to recoil when having light shone upon them.

I suppose the difference between them and the Pig-Men is that the Gatherers were amoral bastards anyway, while the Pig-Men are implied to be mental patients and poor people i.e. the victims of society.

Ah, I guess I was never sure if the Gatherers really were Alexander's original servants or not. Some of the wiki information describe them as creatures made from soldiers who deserted their posts in the war.

Still none of those were really given front and center airing in the original game, where as you have to go through the holding pens in this one.

[Kein]

#4: The Pig Masks! who was putting them everywhere? what was their purpose?

It was like the trail. Hansel and Greta, breadcrumbs ,etc.

Yeah but who was leaving them around? what I mean is sometimes I would leave a room, and then come back, and there would be one there suddenly! the best example I can think of is when you go into the room where you have to lift up the Rifle, and when you go into the area behind there you look through the window, and one of those masks is suddenly on the table when it wasn't there while you were in the room!
Another example (If I remember correctly it may have been something else.), when you have to put some wheels on a machine there is no Pig mask, but when you come back to it, there is one next to it!

So that's why I'm wondering who was leaving them around, or was it just Mandus being crazy, and most of them didn't actually exist?

They weren't real, not in the normal meaning. They are like traces of memory.