[Suggestions] Gameplay frustration in Amnesia

[snakebyte]

I personally hate when in a CS i must search for a very little thing (like a key) in big rooms with no indication. Most times i am forced to see some walkthrough on youtube.

What do you hate most in an Amnesia CS?

Do you think that some tricks to help player (e.g. a barrel that fall from a certein height, so the player look up to an hatch ceiling) can get the gameplay too easy?

[Romulator]

Spoiler below!

Improper/Unnecessary Jumpscares.
Poor Grammar.
Loose Immersion.
Poor Mapping.
Few to no scary events.
Poor or cliché storyline.
Hallucination enemies.
Few puzzles.
Too many puzzles.
Sections which are pretty much un-completable without dying (makes grunt disappear).
Basic geometric mapping (not a hate, but using 45 degree walls somewhere at least once is good).
Troll based CS.
No voice acting/actresses.
Unrealistic lighting.

Just a few. I have more praises than hates, but that's for another topic

In response to your second question:
Yes and no. Things that make you look somewhere specifically can make something appear more easily towards the player who is unaware of such. There's a CS somewhere on this forum and in the beginning you need to throw a rock at a plank of wood to make a lantern roll towards you. Looking at that plank of wood, I would have no idea how what to throw rocks at to make that lantern roll towards me.

Just abusing the StartPlayerLookAt() can be a nuisance when it comes to forcing the player to look at something which just happens. Just because the barrel is about to roll doesn't mean the player MUST look at it. They could always optionally investigate the source of the fall, in case something caused it to roll down to you.

Edit: Spoilered my list. Realised it was a bit extensive.

[PutraenusAlivius]

• Awful grammar (u awake in scawy mansion and u must find keys 2 git out)
  
• Too overused storylines (You awoke in a castle and you must get out because something is chasing you.)
  
• Illogical jumpscares (A naked man with his ding-dong at your face with an ear-piercing scream is not scary.)
  
• Bad lighting (If the setting is at night, then don't use a white light for the windows you idiot.)
  
• Poofers (Annoying.)
  
• Troll mods (Yes, that jumpscary mod for PDP is really scary!)
  

[snakebyte]

I approve your critics, but in my original post i referred to gameplay mechanics.

How much time can you explore the same area (to find a puzzle item) before get frustrated?

In my CS the player is stuck inside a room full of details (he will be inside this room may times in a game). The first time there are no puzzle item to find, but when 5 minutes are passed an event will occurs and the player can go forward in the game.

In 5 minutes the player can explore this environment (Rooms full of details) in which he will pass the most time but he can't do anything to force the gameplay and he doesn't know this.

Do you think can this approach be wrong?

[PutraenusAlivius]

How much time can you explore the same area (to find a puzzle item) before get frustrated?

Max. 5-6 minutes. Or if I have to search the whole area 3-4 times.

In my CS the player is stuck inside a room full of details (he will be inside this room may times in a game). The first time there are no puzzle item to find, but when 5 minutes are passed an event will occurs and the player can go forward in the game.

5 minutes? Make it 1-2 minutes. 5 minutes is too long. 1 second is too short.

In 5 minutes the player can explore this environment (Rooms full of details) in which he will pass the most time but he can't do anything to force the gameplay and he doesn't know this.

Do you think can this approach be wrong?

Well that depends on what you want. If it's an engrossing storyline, gameplay always comes first (debatable).

[RaideX]

Bad lighting (If the setting is at night, then don't use a white light for the windows you idiot.)

In all honesty. White light at night isn't the worst thing to do. It is very much plausible if set up correctly.

Mainly due to the fact that it isn't pitch black at night. (Moon reflection = white'ish light)

[MrBehemoth]

• I second SomethingRidiculous - bad grammar and spelling actually ruin it for me, even in a casual/funny cs. There are two kinds of people: those who don't mind bad grammer and spelling and those who do. If you're one of the former, you won't understand how jarring it can be. If you're one of the latter, you don't understand how someone could release a cs/conversion without proof reading it first. Some people aren't so good at writing and that's fine, everyone has different skills, but we should think of grammar and spelling errors as bugs. If you're not so good at coding, you get help from someone who is. Writing is no different.
  
• Also, platforming. The HPL engines are not designed for jumping and climbing. It's imprecise and it doesn't feel right in a defenseless-survival-horror context, unless the story calls for your character to be some kind of acrobat.
  
• @snakebyte, timed delays are a pet hate of mine. There is no sweet-spot between a non-frustrating and a realistically long waiting time. I would not base the delay on time at all - I would base it on activity. For example, the event could occur 5/10 seconds after the player has interacted with 3 items, or when they've moved around the room a certain amount. That way, efficient or impatient players won't have to wait at all; deliberate, thoughtful players will get to experience the immersive feeling of having waited; and everyone will understand that something spontaneous has happened after a delay. On top of that, if the players doesn't realise they are waiting for an event to occur, they might get up without pausing the game and completely miss it.
  
  
• I don't mind searching for an item though, as long as there is the reward of it turning out to be in a logical place after all. For example,
  Spoiler below!
  

  the key in Daniel's room - it made sense for him to hide it in the cavity behind a painting, which was obviously built into the castle for the purpose of hiding things. Plus getting to smash the jar is a small reward for your search.
  

[MsHannerBananer]

I personally despise it when a custom story or full conversion mod isn't clear in which it wants you to do. I watch more let's plays of custom stories than I play for myself, so I see it happen more often in let's plays, however this is mostly chalked up to them not reading the notes carefully or paying attention to mementos than anything else.

However there are the slight few that just don't tell you what to do at all, or are difficult to progress in because of the way the mapping is set up. I remember playing White Night and not being able to progress for hours in the room with the cage, because I couldn't fricken see the crowbar in the darkness.

While I'm guilty of maybe sometimes overplaying directions on what to do for puzzles, I find that a helping nudge after a certain amount of time of doing nothing is necessary in the less obvious puzzles. If more modders would take more care into providing helpful, but not too revealing hints, puzzles would still be challenging but just a little easier to complete, therefore less rage worthy.

What I think gameplay lacks these days is creativeness. You don't have to be good at modelling in order to make something in Amnesia. I created my own morgue body coolers with just some planes. They aren't very pretty and are really just holes in a metal wall, but the fact that it looks different is what counts. And the puzzles are usually all the same, especially when it comes to levers. I'm guilty of this as well, turn on or off some levers to make something work or stop working. I feel that there is a lot more that could be done with the gameplay mechanics than what's usually done.

[PutraenusAlivius]

"...And the puzzles are usually all the same, especially when it comes to levers. I'm guilty of this as well, turn on or off some levers to make something work or stop working..."

I agree with this. If you are a killer, you won't just place one obvious lever that reveals your place of hiding bodies do you?

[Hardarm]

(You awoke in a castle and you must get out because something is chasing you.)

deja vu