The 4 stories we tell ourselves about death

**i3670** · 03-19-2014, 11:12 PM

(03-19-2014, 08:36 PM)BAndrew Wrote: @Naked? No

Agreed. I particulary liked what he said about legacy because unlike the other 3, it is a hidden "path" to salvation from death. People can "live forever" as larger whole whether this is nation, country, children, family, genes, work, or whatever.

Except that everything, including our planet, our solar system, even the universe, is bound to death. You and everything you have done will eventually be forgotten, it is just a matter of time.

**BAndrew** · 03-19-2014, 11:43 PM

(03-19-2014, 11:12 PM)i3670 Wrote: Except that everything, including our planet, our solar system, even the universe, is bound to death. You and everything you have done will eventually be forgotten, it is just a matter of time.

Of course, but people don't realise this. They rather live with the illusion that they can defy or even defeat death than face their inevitable fate.

**i3670** · 03-19-2014, 11:56 PM

Totally agree with you there, it's an act of eluding

**eliasfrost** · 03-20-2014, 12:10 AM

I personally think that living on in the thoughts of others, or in the history of a nation, culture, family etc; if only for just a short period of time, is in a sense an extention of your existence, though not physical but in memory and emotional. I consider a person's legacy to be the only true extension of ones self yet conceived.

That said, leaving anything behind could be thought as an extension of your existence, or at least the remnant of it which evokes the memory of you once existing, you know.

These kind of things are floaty.

**BAndrew** · 03-20-2014, 12:25 AM

@Naked? No

I don't get it. "living on in the thoughts of others, or in the history of a nation, culture, family etc" doesn't make you alive. Yeah I know it's nice to think that a part of you will continue to exist and blah blah blah but that's a story we tell ourselves to feel better. If you die it's over*. Even if the whole universe "remembers" you, nothing can bring you back in life. You simply cease to exist and your legacy can't change that. If it makes you feel better then it is OK I suppose, but be aware that there is a difference between being alive and being known.

*Unless there is a God or an afterlife of course.

Post updated: Added an article for further reading.

**i3670** · 03-20-2014, 12:45 AM

Yes, his body has ceased to exist, but his thoughts live on in writing (as long as they exist).

I do believe we have an absurd conqueror here

Spoiler below!

BAndrew, have you heard David Mitchell's joke about heaven?

**BAndrew** · 03-20-2014, 12:52 AM

Thoughts aren't living things in the first place as far as I know, are they? You are basically your brain. Your consciousness, your senses, your thoughts and everything else is processed and hapenning at your brain.
It's death = Your death

And no I haven't heard about it.

**i3670** · 03-20-2014, 01:00 AM

Yes, thought themselves aren't living beings with veins and blood but they carry the thinking process of the author. I get know Dostoyevkey's and Fitzgerald's thoughts through their novels.

David Mitchell's joke

Spoiler below!

**BAndrew** · 03-20-2014, 01:08 AM

We agree on that.

PS: I don't think atheists would say "no" to heaven if it was offered to them after death Tongue

**eliasfrost** · 03-20-2014, 01:40 AM

I don't think about existence in the sense of whether you're alive or not. I look at it as being real, and you can be real no matter if you're dead or not. By living on in the memory of others, or in the written word or whatever, my existence (or at least the knowledge that I have existed, proving that I once was) is an extension to my self.

Being an atheist I don't think about it in a spiritual sense or that I am actually going to "live on" literally. The way I think about death is that I die and that's it. But it's nice to know that I may or may not continue to exist for other people, either through memory, through my own words or any other kind of stuff I leave behind, it's the evidence that I once have lived that extends my existence until I fade away in time, just like everyone does. That's legacy, and it's not spiritual.

There's more to death than just "the end", and I don't think seeing some comfort in it through other ways than just coming to peace with the fact that you disappear is in any ways less "true" or a "right" way to view death, I think it's a nice thought that I will continue to "live on" through the memory of my offspring or my spouse until I finally fade, either through that they forget or that what I left behind is lost.

But in no way do I think it's some sort of way to relive, that's absurd in my opinion, but to just leave it at the fact that I just disappear is even more absurd to me. I remember my grandparents and a few friends that have passed away, they exist in my memory, but they are not alive. But I can surely say that they are real, and that's what matters at the end of the day

I don't wish to be black and white regarding questions like this, thus why I said that these kind of things are floaty in my previous post.